Discussion:
UnicodeDecodeError: 'utf-8' codec can't decode byte 0xb6 in position
(too old to reply)
Νίκος
2013-09-29 07:49:27 UTC
Permalink
Hello although my code is correct just today i saw this in the error_log

[Sun Sep 29 07:44:43 2013] [error] [client 173.245.49.126] Traceback
(most recent call last):
[Sun Sep 29 07:44:43 2013] [error] [client 173.245.49.126] File
"/home/nikos/public_html/cgi-bin/metrites.py", line 30, in <module>
[Sun Sep 29 07:44:43 2013] [error] [client 173.245.49.126] host =
socket.gethostbyaddr( ipval ) [0]
[Sun Sep 29 07:44:43 2013] [error] [client 173.245.49.126]
UnicodeDecodeError: 'utf-8' codec can't decode byte 0xb6 in position 0:
invalid start byte
[Sun Sep 29 07:44:43 2013] [error] [client 173.245.49.126] Premature end
of script headers: metrites.py


Which should never had happened since i use the following code:


ipval = ( os.environ.get('HTTP_CF_CONNECTING_IP') or
os.environ.get('REMOTE_ADDR', "Cannot Resolve") )
city = "??????? ????"
host = "??????? ?????????"
try:
gi = pygeoip.GeoIP('/usr/local/share/GeoIPCity.dat')
city = gi.time_zone_by_addr( ipval )
host = socket.gethostbyaddr( ipval ) [0]
except socket.gaierror as e:
print( "metrites.py => (%s): " % lastvisit, repr( sys.exc_info() ),
file=open('/tmp/err.out', 'w') )

So vene if somethign might have gone wrong with the 'host' assignment,
'host' should have defaulted to "??????? ?????????"

why the utf-8 error?
Chris Angelico
2013-09-29 07:53:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
Hello although my code is correct just today i saw this in the error_log
You retain this ridiculous arrogance that your code is somehow
"correct", despite the problems you continually face. Do not these
problems prove that your code is NOT correct?

ChrisA
Νίκος
2013-09-29 07:53:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
Hello although my code is correct just today i saw this in the error_log
[Sun Sep 29 07:44:43 2013] [error] [client 173.245.49.126] Traceback
[Sun Sep 29 07:44:43 2013] [error] [client 173.245.49.126] File
"/home/nikos/public_html/cgi-bin/metrites.py", line 30, in <module>
[Sun Sep 29 07:44:43 2013] [error] [client 173.245.49.126] host =
socket.gethostbyaddr( ipval ) [0]
[Sun Sep 29 07:44:43 2013] [error] [client 173.245.49.126]
invalid start byte
[Sun Sep 29 07:44:43 2013] [error] [client 173.245.49.126] Premature end
of script headers: metrites.py
ipval = ( os.environ.get('HTTP_CF_CONNECTING_IP') or
os.environ.get('REMOTE_ADDR', "Cannot Resolve") )
city = "??????? ????"
host = "??????? ?????????"
gi = pygeoip.GeoIP('/usr/local/share/GeoIPCity.dat')
city = gi.time_zone_by_addr( ipval )
host = socket.gethostbyaddr( ipval ) [0]
print( "metrites.py => (%s): " % lastvisit, repr( sys.exc_info() ),
file=open('/tmp/err.out', 'w') )
So vene if somethign might have gone wrong with the 'host' assignment,
'host' should have defaulted to "??????? ?????????"
why the utf-8 error?
Since this is not a socket.gaierror it wants:

except Exception as e: ?

i just tried it and now it works.

but then agian why the

Re: UnicodeDecodeError: 'utf-8' codec can't decode byte 0xb6 in position
0: invalid start byte

when it comes to dtermine the 'host' ?
Chris Angelico
2013-09-29 08:00:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
invalid start byte
Something's trying to decode a stream of bytes as UTF-8, and it's not
UTF-8. Work out what in your code is bytes and what is strings, and do
your own conversions.

http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/Unicode.html

READ IT. Do not write another line of code until you actually
understand what he's saying there.

ChrisA
Νίκος
2013-09-29 08:04:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris Angelico
Post by Νίκος
invalid start byte
Something's trying to decode a stream of bytes as UTF-8, and it's not
UTF-8. Work out what in your code is bytes and what is strings, and do
your own conversions.
http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/Unicode.html
READ IT. Do not write another line of code until you actually
understand what he's saying there.
ChrisA
okey i will, but isnt this just weird:

How come all these daysthe followinf line work as expected:

host = socket.gethostbyaddr( ipval ) [0]

and only just today just happened to output:
UnicodeDecodeError: 'utf-8' codec can't decode byte 0xb6 in position 0:
invalid start byte erros?

Nothign got added in my script. This is the only line that tried to
determine the host.
Chris Angelico
2013-09-29 08:07:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
host = socket.gethostbyaddr( ipval ) [0]
Maybe the ipval is different. Maybe something else is causing the
error. I wonder how, in Python, you would find out which one it is?
Wouldn't it be nice if Python had a function - statement in Python 2 -
that told you what something was.

ChrisA
Νίκος
2013-09-29 08:19:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris Angelico
Post by Νίκος
host = socket.gethostbyaddr( ipval ) [0]
Maybe the ipval is different. Maybe something else is causing the
error. I wonder how, in Python, you would find out which one it is?
Wouldn't it be nice if Python had a function - statement in Python 2 -
that told you what something was.
The snippet is this:

ipval = ( os.environ.get('HTTP_CF_CONNECTING_IP') or
os.environ.get('REMOTE_ADDR', "Cannot Resolve") )
city = "??????? ????"
host = "??????? ?????????"
try:
gi = pygeoip.GeoIP('/usr/local/share/GeoIPCity.dat')
city = gi.time_zone_by_addr( ipval )
host = socket.gethostbyaddr( ipval ) [0]
except Exception as e:
print( "metrites.py => (%s): " % lastvisit, repr( sys.exc_info() ),
file=open('/tmp/err.out', 'w') )


ipval is suposed to get just an ip address.
ip addresses doesnt change its just number seperated by dots.
the same provider i uses yesterday i continue to use today, i just
restrated the router and got a new ip address and after the new address
got assignes to me.

unicode decore error related to host started to happen.
Can someone explain this or have a way to troubleshoot it because this
error is bugging me for several months now but not all the time just in
cases liek miens today.
Chris Angelico
2013-09-29 08:23:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
ipval is suposed to get just an ip address.
ip addresses doesnt change its just number seperated by dots.
That's one way an IP address can be rendered. It's not the only one.
There's an entire category of IP addresses that's usually written with
colons rather than dots. However, I reiterate: How do you KNOW what's
in ipval? I wonder if there's an easy way for you to find out...

ChrisA
Νίκος
2013-09-29 08:30:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris Angelico
Post by Νίκος
ipval is suposed to get just an ip address.
ip addresses doesnt change its just number seperated by dots.
That's one way an IP address can be rendered. It's not the only one.
There's an entire category of IP addresses that's usually written with
colons rather than dots. However, I reiterate: How do you KNOW what's
in ipval? I wonder if there's an easy way for you to find out...
ChrisA
yes it is, i take it you mean to just print the damn varibale to see
what on eath is actually outputs back....
Νίκος
2013-09-29 08:37:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
Post by Chris Angelico
Post by Νίκος
ipval is suposed to get just an ip address.
ip addresses doesnt change its just number seperated by dots.
That's one way an IP address can be rendered. It's not the only one.
There's an entire category of IP addresses that's usually written with
colons rather than dots. However, I reiterate: How do you KNOW what's
in ipval? I wonder if there's an easy way for you to find out...
ChrisA
yes it is, i take it you mean to just print the damn varibale to see
what on eath is actually outputs back....
Here, as exactly as i though of it:

print( ipval ) returned 46.198.177.249

just a noirmal IPv4 ip address.

which leaved the questions of:

[Sun Sep 29 07:44:43 2013] [error] [client 173.245.49.126] Traceback
(most recent call last):
[Sun Sep 29 07:44:43 2013] [error] [client 173.245.49.126] File
"/home/nikos/public_html/cgi-bin/metrites.py", line 30, in <module>
[Sun Sep 29 07:44:43 2013] [error] [client 173.245.49.126] host =
socket.gethostbyaddr( ipval ) [0]
[Sun Sep 29 07:44:43 2013] [error] [client 173.245.49.126]
UnicodeDecodeError: 'utf-8' codec can't decode byte 0xb6 in position 0:
invalid start byte
[Sun Sep 29 07:44:43 2013] [error] [client 173.245.49.126] Premature end
of script headers: metrites.py


What on earth it cant decode?
Steven D'Aprano
2013-09-29 09:45:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
Post by Νίκος
Post by Chris Angelico
ipval is suposed to get just an ip address. ip addresses doesnt
change its just number seperated by dots.
That's one way an IP address can be rendered. It's not the only one.
There's an entire category of IP addresses that's usually written with
colons rather than dots. However, I reiterate: How do you KNOW what's
in ipval? I wonder if there's an easy way for you to find out...
ChrisA
yes it is, i take it you mean to just print the damn varibale to see
what on eath is actually outputs back....
print( ipval ) returned 46.198.177.249
............................^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Post by Νίκος
[Sun Sep 29 07:44:43 2013] [error] [client 173.245.49.126]
.............................................^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


Given that the error occurred hours ago, I don't think you'll be able to
diagnose why it happened unless it happens again.


Another thought comes to mind... unless you have changed your habits, I
recall that you edit the source code live. If that is the case, it is
possible that the error actually occurred in a completely unrelated line,
if you happened to be editing the file at the moment the error occurred.
--
Steven
Νίκος
2013-09-29 10:24:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steven D'Aprano
Post by Νίκος
Post by Νίκος
Post by Chris Angelico
ipval is suposed to get just an ip address. ip addresses doesnt
change its just number seperated by dots.
That's one way an IP address can be rendered. It's not the only one.
There's an entire category of IP addresses that's usually written with
colons rather than dots. However, I reiterate: How do you KNOW what's
in ipval? I wonder if there's an easy way for you to find out...
ChrisA
yes it is, i take it you mean to just print the damn varibale to see
what on eath is actually outputs back....
print( ipval ) returned 46.198.177.249
............................^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Post by Νίκος
[Sun Sep 29 07:44:43 2013] [error] [client 173.245.49.126]
.............................................^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Given that the error occurred hours ago, I don't think you'll be able to
diagnose why it happened unless it happens again.
Another thought comes to mind... unless you have changed your habits, I
recall that you edit the source code live. If that is the case, it is
possible that the error actually occurred in a completely unrelated line,
if you happened to be editing the file at the moment the error occurred.
You remembr correctly, i'am still editing the source code live to
reflect instant changes.

But....at that moment and all mornign long i wasnt altering the code at
all when this error occured and i just tried it at the moment as iam
typing it this by alterting the

except Exception as e: ===> except socket.gaierror as e:
which cannot handle unicore realted errors and the exact same error
appeared with my ip address involved at the error log.

so, the question that arises again and reamins is how come 'host' vars
gets a values most of the times and sometimes it just outputs back
unicode related erros.

I must tell you that i had this problem also months ago, but since i
couldnt able to solve it i left it as it was, but it just started to
make things more and more hectic.
Dave Angel
2013-09-29 11:11:23 UTC
Permalink
On 29/9/2013 06:24, ????? wrote:

<snip>
Post by Νίκος
which cannot handle unicore realted errors and the exact same error
appeared with my ip address involved at the error log.
so, the question that arises again and reamins is how come 'host' vars
gets a values most of the times and sometimes it just outputs back
unicode related erros.
I must tell you that i had this problem also months ago, but since i
couldnt able to solve it i left it as it was, but it just started to
make things more and more hectic.
it would be interesting to see a more complete stack trace. But I'd
guess that in the process of looking up the ip address at the dns
servers, somebody is producing a non-ascii byte string that isn't
encoded in utf-8. It might conceivably be in your /etc/hosts file as
well, assuming gethostbyname() looks there when the internet query
fails.
--
DaveA
Νίκος
2013-09-29 11:25:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dave Angel
<snip>
Post by Νίκος
which cannot handle unicore realted errors and the exact same error
appeared with my ip address involved at the error log.
so, the question that arises again and reamins is how come 'host' vars
gets a values most of the times and sometimes it just outputs back
unicode related erros.
I must tell you that i had this problem also months ago, but since i
couldnt able to solve it i left it as it was, but it just started to
make things more and more hectic.
it would be interesting to see a more complete stack trace. But I'd
guess that in the process of looking up the ip address at the dns
servers, somebody is producing a non-ascii byte string that isn't
encoded in utf-8. It might conceivably be in your /etc/hosts file as
well, assuming gethostbyname() looks there when the internet query
fails.
Thank you for being willing to look this further.

root at secure [~]# cat /etc/hosts
127.0.0.1 localhost.localdomain localhost
84.200.17.58 secure.superhost.gr secure
root at secure [~]#

Just tell me what else file contents or error_log output you want me to
show you from my server and i will.

Here is my domain's DNS Zone Entry in case it will helpo with something:

let me show you how superhost.gr entry appears via WHM in the Zoen section.

Code:
; cPanel first:11.38.2.7 (update_time):1380448502
Cpanel::ZoneFile::VERSION:1.3 hostname:secure.superhost.gr latest:11.38.2.7
; Zone file for superhost.gr
$TTL 14400
superhost.gr. 86400 IN SOA ns1.superhost.gr. nikos.gr33k.gmail.com. (
2013092903 ;Serial Number
86400 ;refresh
7200 ;retry
3600000 ;expire
86400 )

superhost.gr. 86400 IN NS ns1.superhost.gr.
superhost.gr. 86400 IN NS ns2.superhost.gr.


superhost.gr. 14400 IN A 84.200.17.58

localhost 14400 IN A 127.0.0.1

superhost.gr. 14400 IN MX 0 superhost.gr.

mail 14400 IN CNAME superhost.gr.
www 14400 IN CNAME superhost.gr.
ftp 14400 IN CNAME superhost.gr.



As for the mail iam afrid it outputs this:
Code:
Warning MX CNAME Check WARNING: CNAME was returned for the following MX
records:
mail.superhost.gr
The CNAME(s) that were returned are listed above. This is not ok per the
RFCs and can cause problems including mail being lost!
Error MX A request returns CNAME WARNING: MX records points to a CNAME.
CNAMEs are not allowed in MX records, according to RFC974, RFC1034
3.6.2, RFC1912 2.4, and RFC2181 10.3. The problem MX record(s) are:
mail.superhost.gr points to ['superhost.gr']
This can cause problems
Do i need to chnage the mx record in cloudflare so mx records point to
somethign else being ???????

Also my webpage works as

www.superhost.gr but not as superhost.gr

I have removed my webiste from cloulflare to make thigns simpler and now
in order to viw mywebiste i must give
http://www.superhost.gr

if i give plain http://superhost.gr it doesnt load at all.

The only way is http://www.superhost.gr but no link on my webpage works
when clicked upon.

iam getting this: http://superhost.gr/cgi-sys/defaultwebpage.cgi

Clearly these are DNS and Mail issues.

i have asked PaulVPS which is my provider and they dont f***** care to
help resolve those issues, and i have paid them upo until May 2014.

I just dotn want to lsoe other customers :(
Dave Angel
2013-09-29 11:46:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
Thank you for being willing to look this further.
Willing, but probably not able. I think I know a lot about the
language, and less about the libraries. I know very little about the
administration side of internet use. The reference to /etc/hosts is
only a guess, as I said.
--
DaveA
Νίκος
2013-09-29 11:51:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dave Angel
Post by Νίκος
Thank you for being willing to look this further.
Willing, but probably not able. I think I know a lot about the
language, and less about the libraries. I know very little about the
administration side of internet use. The reference to /etc/hosts is
only a guess, as I said.
Can you please point me to a direction that someone will be able to help
me with this since the provider doesn't care to do so?
Chris “Kwpolska” Warrick
2013-09-29 12:38:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dave Angel
Post by Νίκος
Thank you for being willing to look this further.
Willing, but probably not able. I think I know a lot about the
language, and less about the libraries. I know very little about the
administration side of internet use. The reference to /etc/hosts is
only a guess, as I said.
Can you please point me to a direction that someone will be able to help me
with this since the provider doesn't care to do so?
I can point you to ?find a sysadmin that will work for you and fix
your problems for money?. Where can you find one? That?s not a
question for me. I suggest looking around Greek websites, as someone
speaking the same language as you could help you better.
--
Chris ?Kwpolska? Warrick <http://kwpolska.tk>
PGP: 5EAAEA16
stop html mail | always bottom-post | only UTF-8 makes sense
Chris Angelico
2013-09-29 14:01:58 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, Sep 29, 2013 at 10:38 PM, Chris ?Kwpolska? Warrick
Post by Chris “Kwpolska” Warrick
I can point you to ?find a sysadmin that will work for you and fix
your problems for money?. Where can you find one? That?s not a
question for me. I suggest looking around Greek websites, as someone
speaking the same language as you could help you better.
To be more specific: Greek job-posting web sites. Or maybe general
job-posting web sites will let you search specifically for people who
speak Greek. Either way, you're looking for someone to hire, here.
Maybe you want a contract position, or maybe salaried, but either way,
that's what you're needing.

ChrisA
Chris Angelico
2013-09-29 14:19:49 UTC
Permalink
superhost.gr. 14400 IN MX 0 superhost.gr.
mail 14400 IN CNAME superhost.gr.
Warning MX CNAME Check WARNING: CNAME was returned for the following MX
mail.superhost.gr
The CNAME(s) that were returned are listed above. This is not ok per the
RFCs and can cause problems including mail being lost!
Error MX A request returns CNAME WARNING: MX records points to a
CNAME. CNAMEs are not allowed in MX records, according to RFC974, RFC1034
mail.superhost.gr points to ['superhost.gr']
Once again, you are posting code and errors that don't go with each
other. Your MX record does not point to mail.superhost.gr but to
superhost.gr itself. This makes it extremely difficult to help you.
EXTREMELY.

Two options: Either edit your bind file manually OR use some other
tool for viewing and editing it. If the latter, the bindfile is
utterly meaningless - look at the other tool. If the former, I would
rewrite your zone file like this:

-- cut --
$TTL 14400
@ 86400 IN SOA ns1.superhost.gr. nikosgr33k.gmail.com. (
2013092903 ;Serial Number
86400 ;refresh
7200 ;retry
3600000 ;expire
86400 )

@ 86400 IN NS ns1
@ 86400 IN NS ns2

@ IN A 84.200.17.58

@ IN MX 0 @

mail IN CNAME @
www IN CNAME @
ftp IN CNAME @
-- cut --

The changes I've made are:
1) Remove the massive duplication of your domain name, mainly by using
the shorthand "@". (There are other shorthands you can use, too.)
2) Remove the dot from your email address. Currently your official
address is nikos at gr33k.gmail.com which is flat-out wrong. Fortunately
for you, Gmail will accept nikosgr33k at gmail.com no problem.
3) Eliding the TTLs where they're the same as your default
4) Removing the entry for localhost.superhost.gr which you shouldn't
really be using - it'll only confuse matters. Use localhost as a TLD -
that's how it's set up.

Aside from #2 and #4, this shouldn't actually change your DNS records,
but it'll make your bindfile that much easier to read and work with.

Of course, if you're editing the file with some other program, don't
do this at all. Just use that other program.

ChrisA
Νίκος
2013-09-29 16:06:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris Angelico
superhost.gr. 14400 IN MX 0 superhost.gr.
mail 14400 IN CNAME superhost.gr.
Warning MX CNAME Check WARNING: CNAME was returned for the following MX
mail.superhost.gr
The CNAME(s) that were returned are listed above. This is not ok per the
RFCs and can cause problems including mail being lost!
Error MX A request returns CNAME WARNING: MX records points to a
CNAME. CNAMEs are not allowed in MX records, according to RFC974, RFC1034
mail.superhost.gr points to ['superhost.gr']
Once again, you are posting code and errors that don't go with each
other. Your MX record does not point to mail.superhost.gr but to
superhost.gr itself. This makes it extremely difficult to help you.
EXTREMELY.
Two options: Either edit your bind file manually OR use some other
tool for viewing and editing it. If the latter, the bindfile is
utterly meaningless - look at the other tool. If the former, I would
-- cut --
$TTL 14400
@ 86400 IN SOA ns1.superhost.gr. nikosgr33k.gmail.com. (
2013092903 ;Serial Number
86400 ;refresh
7200 ;retry
3600000 ;expire
86400 )
@ 86400 IN NS ns1
@ 86400 IN NS ns2
@ IN A 84.200.17.58
@ IN MX 0 @
-- cut --
1) Remove the massive duplication of your domain name, mainly by using
2) Remove the dot from your email address. Currently your official
address is nikos at gr33k.gmail.com which is flat-out wrong. Fortunately
for you, Gmail will accept nikosgr33k at gmail.com no problem.
3) Eliding the TTLs where they're the same as your default
4) Removing the entry for localhost.superhost.gr which you shouldn't
really be using - it'll only confuse matters. Use localhost as a TLD -
that's how it's set up.
Aside from #2 and #4, this shouldn't actually change your DNS records,
but it'll make your bindfile that much easier to read and work with.
Of course, if you're editing the file with some other program, don't
do this at all. Just use that other program.
ChrisA
I have tried your setup and still my webpage http://superhost.gr is not
loading at all

i dont ebven have access to cPanel and WHM any more by hostname.

The via WHM i have reset the DNS Zone for superhost.gr and let it
recreate it as WHM wants it by default.

Still same error. No website appearing anymore no access to cPanel & WHM
and no ability to send or receive mail.
Joel Goldstick
2013-09-29 16:14:39 UTC
Permalink
asked and answered. Move on
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Νίκος
2013-09-29 16:19:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Joel Goldstick
asked and answered. Move on
shut up. you are nothign but annoyance here.
Larry Hudson
2013-09-30 03:16:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
Post by Joel Goldstick
asked and answered. Move on
shut up. you are nothign but annoyance here.
Thanks for the laugh.

Absolutely the most hilarious thing you've ever posted!!! :-)

(Ever hear about the pot and the kettle?)
Mark Lawrence
2013-09-30 14:45:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
Post by Joel Goldstick
asked and answered. Move on
shut up. you are nothign but annoyance here.
Absolutely hilarious. Please give up your web work and Python and get a
job writing scripts for comedians, you'd make a large fortune.
--
Cheers.

Mark Lawrence
Νίκος
2013-09-30 18:03:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mark Lawrence
Post by Νίκος
Post by Joel Goldstick
asked and answered. Move on
shut up. you are nothign but annoyance here.
Absolutely hilarious. Please give up your web work and Python and get a
job writing scripts for comedians, you'd make a large fortune.
I learn Python for personal pleasure because i like programming.
Perhaps it would be even better if you quit spamming my thread with your
"funny" quotes.
Antoon Pardon
2013-09-30 18:18:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
Post by Mark Lawrence
Post by Νίκος
Post by Joel Goldstick
asked and answered. Move on
shut up. you are nothign but annoyance here.
Absolutely hilarious. Please give up your web work and Python and get a
job writing scripts for comedians, you'd make a large fortune.
I learn Python for personal pleasure because i like programming.
You may like porgramming, but it is rather obvious you don't like
the python style of programming. So maybe you should chose a
laguage whose style is more to your liking.
Post by Νίκος
Perhaps it would be even better if you quit spamming my thread with your
"funny" quotes.
You have no authority over what people contribute in your thread. Since
you don't seem very considerate about the effect your contributions have
on others, you can hardly expect others to be considerate of you.
--
Antoon Pardon
Mark Lawrence
2013-09-30 18:42:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
Post by Mark Lawrence
Post by Νίκος
Post by Joel Goldstick
asked and answered. Move on
shut up. you are nothign but annoyance here.
Absolutely hilarious. Please give up your web work and Python and get a
job writing scripts for comedians, you'd make a large fortune.
I learn Python for personal pleasure because i like programming.
Perhaps it would be even better if you quit spamming my thread with your
"funny" quotes.
Your approach as given in the pseudocode given below is taking up what,
50% of the bandwidth here? What a waste of a resource.

while "answer_isn't_what_I_want":
keep_asking_question()

You are to this mailing list what King Herod was to baby sitting.

Please drop dead and the sooner the better. Your arrogant attitide to
the numerous people who've tried so hard to help you is disgraceful.
--
Cheers.

Mark Lawrence
Ned Batchelder
2013-09-30 18:54:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mark Lawrence
Please drop dead and the sooner the better. Your arrogant attitide to
the numerous people who've tried so hard to help you is disgraceful.
Mark, I'm as frustrated as anyone by Nikos' threads, but there's really
no call for "Please drop dead." We can do better than that.

--Ned.
Antoon Pardon
2013-09-30 20:51:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ned Batchelder
Post by Mark Lawrence
Please drop dead and the sooner the better. Your arrogant attitide to
the numerous people who've tried so hard to help you is disgraceful.
Mark, I'm as frustrated as anyone by Nikos' threads, but there's really
no call for "Please drop dead." We can do better than that.
I disagree. The "Please drop dead" seems well deserved to me. You may
think it better if people could put themselves above it, but that
doesn't make the remark less deserved.
--
Antoon Pardon
Νίκος
2013-09-30 20:13:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mark Lawrence
Post by Νίκος
Post by Mark Lawrence
Post by Νίκος
Post by Joel Goldstick
asked and answered. Move on
shut up. you are nothign but annoyance here.
Absolutely hilarious. Please give up your web work and Python and get a
job writing scripts for comedians, you'd make a large fortune.
I learn Python for personal pleasure because i like programming.
Perhaps it would be even better if you quit spamming my thread with your
"funny" quotes.
Your approach as given in the pseudocode given below is taking up what,
50% of the bandwidth here? What a waste of a resource.
keep_asking_question()
I was thankfull to the people that tried to help me(excluding you)
Several method have been given to solve the problem.
Other newbies reading this will help them better understand why its
written the way it is if they compare all the solutions.
And yes, i won't rest until i have it working as i think its clearer and
more compact.
Post by Mark Lawrence
You are to this mailing list what King Herod was to baby sitting.
And you are a major asshole leading this list, who is doing nothing else
than critizizing others people's posts, spamming all he way along while
contributing negatively only.
Post by Mark Lawrence
Please drop dead and the sooner the better.
After you please.
Post by Mark Lawrence
Your arrogant attitide to
the numerous people who've tried so hard to help you is disgraceful.
Your ironic attitude on the other hand is what characterizes you.

Triing out various solutions and picking the one that better meets one's
style and needs, is hardly considered as arrogance.
Mark Lawrence
2013-09-30 20:44:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
And you are a major asshole leading this list, who is doing nothing else
than critizizing others people's posts, spamming all he way along while
contributing negatively only.
Really? http://code.activestate.com/lists/python-list/651611/
--
Cheers.

Mark Lawrence
Νίκος
2013-09-30 21:34:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mark Lawrence
Post by Νίκος
And you are a major asshole leading this list, who is doing nothing else
than critizizing others people's posts, spamming all he way along while
contributing negatively only.
Really? http://code.activestate.com/lists/python-list/651611/
One positive comment in the history opposes 10^2 negative ones.
Joel Goldstick
2013-09-30 21:44:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
Post by Νίκος
And you are a major asshole leading this list, who is doing nothing else
than critizizing others people's posts, spamming all he way along while
contributing negatively only.
Really? http://code.activestate.com/**lists/python-list/651611/<http://code.activestate.com/lists/python-list/651611/>
One positive comment in the history opposes 10^2 negative ones.
--
https://mail.python.org/**mailman/listinfo/python-list<https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list>
well, actually no. one positive comment (and I'm sorry your reference
didn't reveal one!) is 10^2-1 times as 10^2 negative comments. Look in a
mirror dude. You are lazy, you charge people for code that you don't even
have under source control, you have no interest in understanding and
studying how your servers work, how python works. You bitch and whine at
people who come along to help you. You are to slothful to look at a
traceback. Your hosting company ignores you apparently because you are
such an sob they don't even want your business. You pick a nickname that
is the defininition of an asshole:
http://www.politicsforum.org/images/flame_warriors/flame_62.php and yet
you return again and again to be rude to all who first try to help you out,
then realize you are such a total jerk that they even wish you an awful
demise without even having met you..

Take a look in the mirror dude.

I don't care if you want to tell me to shut up. It seemed amusing to
others here.
--
Joel Goldstick
http://joelgoldstick.com
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Mark Lawrence
2013-09-30 21:47:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
Post by Mark Lawrence
Post by Νίκος
And you are a major asshole leading this list, who is doing nothing else
than critizizing others people's posts, spamming all he way along while
contributing negatively only.
Really? http://code.activestate.com/lists/python-list/651611/
One positive comment in the history opposes 10^2 negative ones.
Yet more sheer unadulterated rubbish from an imbecile who clearly hasn't
got the faintest idea what he's talking about. Would you please be kind
enough to stand up, your voice is rather muffled. That is after you've
done a proper statistical analysis of the number of positive posts I've
made over the years. You are actually one of the very few people who
has managed to get quite so far up my nose, that's quite an achievement
as by nature I'm actually extremely tolerant.
--
Cheers.

Mark Lawrence
Νίκος
2013-09-30 22:08:41 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, Sep 30, 2013 at 5:34 PM, ????? <nikos.gr33k at gmail.com
And you are a major asshole leading this list, who is doing
nothing else
than critizizing others people's posts, spamming all he way
along while
contributing negatively only.
Really? http://code.activestate.com/__lists/python-list/651611/
<http://code.activestate.com/lists/python-list/651611/>
One positive comment in the history opposes 10^2 negative ones.
--
https://mail.python.org/__mailman/listinfo/python-list
<https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list>
well, actually no. one positive comment (and I'm sorry your reference
didn't reveal one!) is 10^2-1 times as 10^2 negative comments. Look in
a mirror dude. You are lazy, you charge people for code that you don't
even have under source control, you have no interest in understanding
and studying how your servers work, how python works. You bitch and
whine at people who come along to help you. You are to slothful to look
at a traceback. Your hosting company ignores you apparently because you
are such an sob they don't even want your business. You pick a nickname
http://www.politicsforum.org/images/flame_warriors/flame_62.php and yet
you return again and again to be rude to all who first try to help you
out, then realize you are such a total jerk that they even wish you an
awful demise without even having met you..
Take a look in the mirror dude.
I don't care if you want to tell me to shut up. It seemed amusing to
others here.
--
Joel Goldstick
http://joelgoldstick.com
stfu dickhead.
Joel Goldstick
2013-09-30 22:13:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
On Mon, Sep 30, 2013 at 5:34 PM, ????? <nikos.gr33k at gmail.com
And you are a major asshole leading this list, who is doing
nothing else
than critizizing others people's posts, spamming all he way
along while
contributing negatively only.
Really? http://code.activestate.com/__**lists/python-list/651611/<http://code.activestate.com/__lists/python-list/651611/>
<http://code.activestate.com/**lists/python-list/651611/<http://code.activestate.com/lists/python-list/651611/>
One positive comment in the history opposes 10^2 negative ones.
--
https://mail.python.org/__**mailman/listinfo/python-list<https://mail.python.org/__mailman/listinfo/python-list>
<https://mail.python.org/**mailman/listinfo/python-list<https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list>
well, actually no. one positive comment (and I'm sorry your reference
didn't reveal one!) is 10^2-1 times as 10^2 negative comments. Look in
a mirror dude. You are lazy, you charge people for code that you don't
even have under source control, you have no interest in understanding
and studying how your servers work, how python works. You bitch and
whine at people who come along to help you. You are to slothful to look
at a traceback. Your hosting company ignores you apparently because you
are such an sob they don't even want your business. You pick a nickname
http://www.politicsforum.org/**images/flame_warriors/flame_**62.php<http://www.politicsforum.org/images/flame_warriors/flame_62.php> and yet
you return again and again to be rude to all who first try to help you
out, then realize you are such a total jerk that they even wish you an
awful demise without even having met you..
Take a look in the mirror dude.
I don't care if you want to tell me to shut up. It seemed amusing to
others here.
--
Joel Goldstick
http://joelgoldstick.com
stfu dickhead.
--
https://mail.python.org/**mailman/listinfo/python-list<https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list>
that was responsive! You should join your local debating club!

anyway, out!
--
Joel Goldstick
http://joelgoldstick.com
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Mark Lawrence
2013-09-30 22:14:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
On Mon, Sep 30, 2013 at 5:34 PM, ????? <nikos.gr33k at gmail.com
And you are a major asshole leading this list, who is doing
nothing else
than critizizing others people's posts, spamming all he way
along while
contributing negatively only.
Really? http://code.activestate.com/__lists/python-list/651611/
<http://code.activestate.com/lists/python-list/651611/>
One positive comment in the history opposes 10^2 negative ones.
--
https://mail.python.org/__mailman/listinfo/python-list
<https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list>
well, actually no. one positive comment (and I'm sorry your reference
didn't reveal one!) is 10^2-1 times as 10^2 negative comments. Look in
a mirror dude. You are lazy, you charge people for code that you don't
even have under source control, you have no interest in understanding
and studying how your servers work, how python works. You bitch and
whine at people who come along to help you. You are to slothful to look
at a traceback. Your hosting company ignores you apparently because you
are such an sob they don't even want your business. You pick a nickname
http://www.politicsforum.org/images/flame_warriors/flame_62.php and yet
you return again and again to be rude to all who first try to help you
out, then realize you are such a total jerk that they even wish you an
awful demise without even having met you..
Take a look in the mirror dude.
I don't care if you want to tell me to shut up. It seemed amusing to
others here.
--
Joel Goldstick
http://joelgoldstick.com
stfu dickhead.
To quote from The A-Team, "I love it when a plan comes together".
--
Cheers.

Mark Lawrence
Νίκος
2013-09-30 22:19:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mark Lawrence
Post by Νίκος
On Mon, Sep 30, 2013 at 5:34 PM, ????? <nikos.gr33k at gmail.com
And you are a major asshole leading this list, who is doing
nothing else
than critizizing others people's posts, spamming all he way
along while
contributing negatively only.
Really? http://code.activestate.com/__lists/python-list/651611/
<http://code.activestate.com/lists/python-list/651611/>
One positive comment in the history opposes 10^2 negative ones.
--
https://mail.python.org/__mailman/listinfo/python-list
<https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list>
well, actually no. one positive comment (and I'm sorry your reference
didn't reveal one!) is 10^2-1 times as 10^2 negative comments. Look in
a mirror dude. You are lazy, you charge people for code that you don't
even have under source control, you have no interest in understanding
and studying how your servers work, how python works. You bitch and
whine at people who come along to help you. You are to slothful to look
at a traceback. Your hosting company ignores you apparently because you
are such an sob they don't even want your business. You pick a nickname
http://www.politicsforum.org/images/flame_warriors/flame_62.php and yet
you return again and again to be rude to all who first try to help you
out, then realize you are such a total jerk that they even wish you an
awful demise without even having met you..
Take a look in the mirror dude.
I don't care if you want to tell me to shut up. It seemed amusing to
others here.
--
Joel Goldstick
http://joelgoldstick.com
stfu dickhead.
To quote from The A-Team, "I love it when a plan comes together".
2 dickheads names Joe & Mark work together to achieve total bullshit!
Well done Beavis & Butthead!
rofl...
Mark Lawrence
2013-09-30 22:28:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
2 dickheads names Joe & Mark work together to achieve total bullshit!
Well done Beavis & Butthead!
rofl...
Well aside from the fact that you've maintained your record by being
inaccurate with 50% of the names that you've quoted, it appears that
we've something that has very much in common with your website. Which
reminds me, is it still possible to access your users' names and
passwords in plain text or is that something that you've actually
bothered to fix?
--
Cheers.

Mark Lawrence
Νίκος
2013-09-30 22:30:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mark Lawrence
Post by Νίκος
2 dickheads names Joe & Mark work together to achieve total bullshit!
Well done Beavis & Butthead!
rofl...
Well aside from the fact that you've maintained your record by being
inaccurate with 50% of the names that you've quoted, it appears that
we've something that has very much in common with your website. Which
reminds me, is it still possible to access your users' names and
passwords in plain text or is that something that you've actually
bothered to fix?
Nope, it isn't. I have fixed it.
Chris Angelico
2013-09-30 22:43:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
Post by Mark Lawrence
Post by Νίκος
2 dickheads names Joe & Mark work together to achieve total bullshit!
Well done Beavis & Butthead!
rofl...
Well aside from the fact that you've maintained your record by being
inaccurate with 50% of the names that you've quoted, it appears that
we've something that has very much in common with your website. Which
reminds me, is it still possible to access your users' names and
passwords in plain text or is that something that you've actually
bothered to fix?
Nope, it isn't. I have fixed it.
And this doesn't bother you???!?

Nikos, industry best practice is to make sure people can't steal all
your users' passwords *even if they get access to your hard drive*.
Passwords should be stored like this:

"92e25cf5beefd4982cedd2f28b430e0e9d23e0966ee3f20c74f825ebeeee9842"

That's the password "qwer", on an account named "asdf", on a mythical
system. Even knowing that, you can't work out what another password
means. Storing people's passwords in plain text is a HORRIBLE HORRIBLE
idea - and having them accessible to the world is a sign of a complete
and utter lack of any semblance of security.

I understand that bugs happen. But bugs of this criticality should be
your very highest priority... unless you're not actually in business
here, and you're just scamming a bunch of people by pretending you run
a legit enterprise.

ChrisA
Νίκος
2013-09-30 22:48:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris Angelico
Post by Νίκος
Post by Mark Lawrence
Post by Νίκος
2 dickheads names Joe & Mark work together to achieve total bullshit!
Well done Beavis & Butthead!
rofl...
Well aside from the fact that you've maintained your record by being
inaccurate with 50% of the names that you've quoted, it appears that
we've something that has very much in common with your website. Which
reminds me, is it still possible to access your users' names and
passwords in plain text or is that something that you've actually
bothered to fix?
Nope, it isn't. I have fixed it.
And this doesn't bother you???!?
Nikos, industry best practice is to make sure people can't steal all
your users' passwords *even if they get access to your hard drive*.
"92e25cf5beefd4982cedd2f28b430e0e9d23e0966ee3f20c74f825ebeeee9842"
That's the password "qwer", on an account named "asdf", on a mythical
system. Even knowing that, you can't work out what another password
means. Storing people's passwords in plain text is a HORRIBLE HORRIBLE
idea - and having them accessible to the world is a sign of a complete
and utter lack of any semblance of security.
I understand that bugs happen. But bugs of this criticality should be
your very highest priority... unless you're not actually in business
here, and you're just scamming a bunch of people by pretending you run
a legit enterprise.
ChrisA
I don't have the security awareness you have, but i'am learnign at the
process.

What maked you think i store peoples password in plain text?

All the user account passwords i set i do it via cPanel or via WHM.

How those services store the password in the linux server its up to them.
Steven D'Aprano
2013-09-30 23:50:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
stfu dickhead.
And you're back in the kill-file.

*plonk*
--
Steven
Chris Angelico
2013-09-30 22:29:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
Post by Mark Lawrence
Absolutely hilarious. Please give up your web work and Python and get a
job writing scripts for comedians, you'd make a large fortune.
I learn Python for personal pleasure because i like programming.
Perhaps it would be even better if you quit spamming my thread with your
"funny" quotes.
Then maybe you should keep to programming for personal pleasure and
stop trying to make it part of your business. Most of your problems
stem from a perceived urgency - you panic, because you have stupidly
edited your live code again, and come to this list begging for help.
If you were coding purely for pleasure, your problems would not lose
you customers, and you could deal with issues calmly.

To be quite frank, I think you SHOULD lose customers. Suppose you buy
a piece of furniture from some small-time carpenter, and the moving
parts are stuck, it wobbles on its legs, and if anyone uses it who
isn't American, it crashes to the floor (which is how your Unicode
issues make you look). You go and complain, loudly, in front of people
who were looking at his wares and considering buying. He might lose
customers because of your complaint - but if he's selling a dodgy
product, he *should* lose customers. Carpentry for pleasure, or
programming for pleasure, is a fine thing to do, but it should not be
considered business.

Nikos, I sincerely hope that all these problems cause you to go out of
business. Preferably right now, with just enough maintenance to last
till the end of your contracts with people. Then start programming
purely as a hobby, until you actually master the craft.

ChrisA
Ben Finney
2013-09-30 22:42:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris Angelico
Nikos, I sincerely hope that all these problems cause you to go out of
business. Preferably right now, with just enough maintenance to last
till the end of your contracts with people. Then start programming
purely as a hobby, until you actually master the craft.
This is a sentiment I can heartily endorse. Far better than puerile
jeers and hostile desires for violence.

Please, everyone in this thread needs to keep in mind our host's
Diversity Statement:

The Python Software Foundation and the global Python community
welcome and encourage participation by everyone. Our community is
based on mutual respect, tolerance, and encouragement, and we are
working to help each other live up to these principles. We want our
community to be more diverse: whoever you are, and whatever your
background, we welcome you.

Let's keep all discussions here close to those principles.
--
\ ?The trouble with the rat race is that even if you win, you're |
`\ still a rat.? ?Jane Wagner, via Lily Tomlin |
_o__) |
Ben Finney
Νίκος
2013-09-30 22:36:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris Angelico
Post by Νίκος
Post by Mark Lawrence
Absolutely hilarious. Please give up your web work and Python and get a
job writing scripts for comedians, you'd make a large fortune.
I learn Python for personal pleasure because i like programming.
Perhaps it would be even better if you quit spamming my thread with your
"funny" quotes.
Then maybe you should keep to programming for personal pleasure and
stop trying to make it part of your business. Most of your problems
stem from a perceived urgency - you panic, because you have stupidly
edited your live code again, and come to this list begging for help.
If you were coding purely for pleasure, your problems would not lose
you customers, and you could deal with issues calmly.
To be quite frank, I think you SHOULD lose customers. Suppose you buy
a piece of furniture from some small-time carpenter, and the moving
parts are stuck, it wobbles on its legs, and if anyone uses it who
isn't American, it crashes to the floor (which is how your Unicode
issues make you look). You go and complain, loudly, in front of people
who were looking at his wares and considering buying. He might lose
customers because of your complaint - but if he's selling a dodgy
product, he *should* lose customers. Carpentry for pleasure, or
programming for pleasure, is a fine thing to do, but it should not be
considered business.
Nikos, I sincerely hope that all these problems cause you to go out of
business. Preferably right now, with just enough maintenance to last
till the end of your contracts with people. Then start programming
purely as a hobby, until you actually master the craft.
I learn during the process.
That's how i deal with the situation.
I challedge my self and then try to confront the given situation _live_.

It's not wise to do so, but that how i operate.
Apart form that my customer's webistes have no problems, everyhting i do
its domain specific, my domain, DNS and Mail issues for my domain, i
don't play with customer's settings and data.

I have a good sense _not_ to fiddle with their accounts(except from the
time that i have taken the risk to give you root access to helo me with
a python issue, and you've "helped" me appropiately).
Chris Angelico
2013-09-30 22:56:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
I learn during the process.
That's how i deal with the situation.
I challedge my self and then try to confront the given situation _live_.
It's not wise to do so, but that how i operate.
Everyone's learning on the job. (I learned this week that it's
possible to play fast and loose with ARP and routing, to make one
computer look like two and two look like one. That was fun. When I
came up with the concept, I gave my boss a 95% confidence that it'd
work; and so far it's not caused any trouble.) But what you're doing
is charging your customers while you learn the very basics. You can't
sell "Hello, world". Most people expect to go to university to learn a
trade; some spend two decades playing with something before earning a
single dollar (or Euro, or yen).

Learn to code, THEN try to make money at it. Or even leave off the
'then' clause - plenty of people never earn anything from code, and
stay as happy amateurs. There's nothing wrong with that.

ChrisA
Νίκος
2013-09-30 23:14:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris Angelico
But what you're doing
is charging your customers while you learn the very basics.
I designed their websites and they are up and running.
Yes i have charged some money, but they gain what they paid for, a
running website, all of them.

So, its not like i'm ripping off someone here.
Post by Chris Angelico
You can't sell "Hello, world".
I hope i was in the position to sell python code but i'am not.
I learn Python because i like programming.

My reseller site should have been made probably in wordpress or joomla
cms but i decided to code it in Python instead because i like the
language and want it to learn it better and better. It has secret
functions as well.

When i problem occurs i just ask and thats how i progress.
Sometimes i do a little reading too :)
Antoon Pardon
2013-10-01 07:27:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
Post by Chris Angelico
But what you're doing
is charging your customers while you learn the very basics.
I designed their websites and they are up and running.
Yes i have charged some money, but they gain what they paid for, a
running website, all of them.
So, its not like i'm ripping off someone here.
Yes you are. People don't just pay for a running website, with "running"
meaning some vague: "is mostly accesible." People pay for some kind of
guaranteed uptime. Since you don't have the skills to deliver that
guarantee, you are in fact ripping them off.
--
Antoon Pardon
Νίκος
2013-10-01 08:39:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Antoon Pardon
Post by Νίκος
Post by Chris Angelico
But what you're doing
is charging your customers while you learn the very basics.
I designed their websites and they are up and running.
Yes i have charged some money, but they gain what they paid for, a
running website, all of them.
So, its not like i'm ripping off someone here.
Yes you are. People don't just pay for a running website, with "running"
meaning some vague: "is mostly accesible." People pay for some kind of
guaranteed uptime. Since you don't have the skills to deliver that
guarantee, you are in fact ripping them off.
But it has uptime, VPS is always online, i dont make system wide changes
except for the fat that i installed Python 3.3.2 for my personal account
needs.

If i encounter some problem i ask, bu the sad thing is that my provider
doesn't care to help.
Antoon Pardon
2013-10-01 09:10:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
Post by Antoon Pardon
Post by Νίκος
Post by Chris Angelico
But what you're doing
is charging your customers while you learn the very basics.
I designed their websites and they are up and running.
Yes i have charged some money, but they gain what they paid for, a
running website, all of them.
So, its not like i'm ripping off someone here.
Yes you are. People don't just pay for a running website, with "running"
meaning some vague: "is mostly accesible." People pay for some kind of
guaranteed uptime. Since you don't have the skills to deliver that
guarantee, you are in fact ripping them off.
But it has uptime, VPS is always online, i dont make system wide changes
except for the fat that i installed Python 3.3.2 for my personal account
needs.
That is has uptime is not enough. The question is: Should something go
wrong, are you skilled enough to fix it within a reasonable time?
In other words, when the side does go down, how long will it take you
to have it up again?

Going by the skill level you have shown here, you are unable to cope
with such situations in a way that can be expected.
Post by Νίκος
If i encounter some problem i ask, bu the sad thing is that my provider
doesn't care to help.
Then either you have the wrong provider or you are so lacking in skill
that your provider is fed up with spoon feeding you the basic solutions.

Going with your history here, I'll go with the latter. Especially as
I think it entirely possible that your provider has already helped you
and provided you the necessary answers but you rejected them because
you didn't like the particular style of the answer.
--
Antoon Pardon
Steven D'Aprano
2013-10-02 01:36:56 UTC
Permalink
People pay for some kind of guaranteed uptime.
You have *no idea* what sort of contract Nikos has with his customers.
Nor do you know have any idea what fees he charges. For all we know, he
is promising, and charging for, 99% uptime while delivering 99.9% uptime.

I know you are getting off on hating Nikos, but take it elsewhere.
--
Steven
Antoon Pardon
2013-10-02 07:23:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steven D'Aprano
People pay for some kind of guaranteed uptime.
You have *no idea* what sort of contract Nikos has with his customers.
Nor do you know have any idea what fees he charges. For all we know, he
is promising, and charging for, 99% uptime while delivering 99.9% uptime.
Which is beside the point. It is very well possible to rip someone of
and in the mean time have a contract that makes ripping that person of,
legal.

It is also possible one behaves in a way similar as if ripping
others off, but that your "victims" are lucky and don't experience
a bad outcome (yet).
Post by Steven D'Aprano
I know you are getting off on hating Nikos, but take it elsewhere.
I know you are getting off insinuating hate of those who dare to
critisize Nikos harshly, but take it elsewhere.
--
Antoon Pardon
Νίκος
2013-10-02 08:49:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steven D'Aprano
People pay for some kind of guaranteed uptime.
You have *no idea* what sort of contract Nikos has with his customers.
Nor do you know have any idea what fees he charges. For all we know, he
is promising, and charging for, 99% uptime while delivering 99.9% uptime.
I know you are getting off on hating Nikos, but take it elsewhere.
It is good to know that some people understand me better then others.

Thank you steven.
Νίκος
2013-10-02 08:52:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by Antoon Pardon
Post by Steven D'Aprano
People pay for some kind of guaranteed uptime.
You have *no idea* what sort of contract Nikos has with his customers.
Nor do you know have any idea what fees he charges. For all we know, he
is promising, and charging for, 99% uptime while delivering 99.9% uptime.
Which is beside the point. It is very well possible to rip someone of
and in the mean time have a contract that makes ripping that person of,
legal.
It is also possible one behaves in a way similar as if ripping
others off, but that your "victims" are lucky and don't experience
a bad outcome (yet).
Post by Steven D'Aprano
I know you are getting off on hating Nikos, but take it elsewhere.
I know you are getting off insinuating hate of those who dare to
critisize Nikos harshly, but take it elsewhere.
I'am not ripping anyone off.
I designed all their websites and i host all their websiutes.
All their websites do work properly as expected.

I only trial and error with my perosnal domain, personal account only.
The only thing i did change system wide was installing Python 3.3.2 for
perosnal reasons and rewrite the code for that.

But, wy iam a sitting here and explainign myself to you.....

Grant Edwards
2013-10-01 14:29:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
I learn during the process.
That's fine as long as your customers are told up front that what
they're paying for is _not_ a working usable service, but rahter a
training program for you personally (a training program that's failing
rather badly, IMO).
Post by Νίκος
That's how i deal with the situation. I challedge my self and then
try to confront the given situation _live_.
That's a lousy attitude to have if your customers expect something
that works rather than some in-progress hacked-up POS you're using for
practice.
--
Grant Edwards grant.b.edwards Yow! I want to mail a
at bronzed artichoke to
gmail.com Nicaragua!
Ned Batchelder
2013-09-29 10:53:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
Post by Chris Angelico
Post by Νίκος
invalid start byte
Something's trying to decode a stream of bytes as UTF-8, and it's not
UTF-8. Work out what in your code is bytes and what is strings, and do
your own conversions.
http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/Unicode.html
READ IT. Do not write another line of code until you actually
understand what he's saying there.
ChrisA
host = socket.gethostbyaddr( ipval ) [0]
invalid start byte erros?
Nothign got added in my script. This is the only line that tried to
determine the host.
This is the nature of Unicode pain in Python 2 (Python 3 has a different
kind!). This may help you understand what's going on:
http://nedbatchelder.com/text/unipain.html

--Ned.
Terry Reedy
2013-09-29 17:30:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ned Batchelder
This is the nature of Unicode pain in Python 2 (Python 3 has a different
http://nedbatchelder.com/text/unipain.html
This is really excellent and I bookmarked it.

There is one minor error: "the conversion from int to float can't fail,"
Post by Ned Batchelder
float(10**1000)
Traceback (most recent call last):
File "<pyshell#0>", line 1, in <module>
float(10**1000)
OverflowError: long int too large to convert to float

Even when it succeeds, it can fail in the sense of losing information.
Post by Ned Batchelder
int(float(12345678901234567890))
12345678901234567168
Post by Ned Batchelder
float(int(1.55))
1.0

This is somewhat analogous to a combination of errors='ignore' and
errors='replace' (with random garbage).

I think the presentation would be strengthened with the correction, as
it shows that the problems of conversion are *not* unique to bytes and
unicode.
--
Terry Jan Reedy
Ned Batchelder
2013-09-29 19:08:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Terry Reedy
Post by Ned Batchelder
This is the nature of Unicode pain in Python 2 (Python 3 has a different
http://nedbatchelder.com/text/unipain.html
This is really excellent and I bookmarked it.
There is one minor error: "the conversion from int to float can't fail,"
Post by Ned Batchelder
float(10**1000)
File "<pyshell#0>", line 1, in <module>
float(10**1000)
OverflowError: long int too large to convert to float
Even when it succeeds, it can fail in the sense of losing information.
Post by Ned Batchelder
int(float(12345678901234567890))
12345678901234567168
Post by Ned Batchelder
float(int(1.55))
1.0
This is somewhat analogous to a combination of errors='ignore' and
errors='replace' (with random garbage).
I think the presentation would be strengthened with the correction, as
it shows that the problems of conversion are *not* unique to bytes and
unicode.
Thanks, these are excellent points.

--Ned.
Steven D'Aprano
2013-09-29 14:08:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ned Batchelder
This is the nature of Unicode pain in Python 2 (Python 3 has a different
http://nedbatchelder.com/text/unipain.html
That's a fantastic explanation, and I have pointed Nikos at that before,
but he is running Python 3, not 2, so the obvious problem is not likely
to be the actual problem.
--
Steven
Νίκος
2013-09-29 07:59:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris Angelico
Post by Νίκος
Hello although my code is correct just today i saw this in the error_log
You retain this ridiculous arrogance that your code is somehow
"correct", despite the problems you continually face. Do not these
problems prove that your code is NOT correct?
ChrisA
You fail to understand that these code i now use was written with the
help of regulars here and yes its correct.


As i said in my previous post i already identified that the problem was
at the error handling.


Since this is not a socket.gaierror it wants:

except Exception as e: ?

i just tried it and now it works.

but then again why the: UnicodeDecodeError: 'utf-8' codec can't
decode byte 0xb6 in position 0: invalid start byte

when it comes to determine the 'host' ?
Grant Edwards
2013-09-30 13:51:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Νίκος
You fail to understand that these code i now use was written with the
help of regulars here and yes its correct.
If you're code is correct, then use it and be happy.

There's no need to bother us if your code is correct.
--
Grant Edwards grant.b.edwards Yow! Can I have an IMPULSE
at ITEM instead?
gmail.com
Mark Lawrence
2013-09-30 14:51:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Grant Edwards
Post by Νίκος
You fail to understand that these code i now use was written with the
help of regulars here and yes its correct.
If you're code is correct, then use it and be happy.
There's no need to bother us if your code is correct.
Could this be an extremely rare case whereby the original code is 100%
correct but the problems have been exacerbated by the many suggested
patches given here being 100% incorrect?
--
Cheers.

Mark Lawrence
Chris Angelico
2013-09-30 15:06:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mark Lawrence
Post by Grant Edwards
Post by Νίκος
You fail to understand that these code i now use was written with the
help of regulars here and yes its correct.
If you're code is correct, then use it and be happy.
There's no need to bother us if your code is correct.
Could this be an extremely rare case whereby the original code is 100%
correct but the problems have been exacerbated by the many suggested patches
given here being 100% incorrect?
Jests and barbs left aside, I believe his definition of "correct" is
"wasn't crashing". Earlier in this thread there was a hint that he'd
tightened a bare except to one specific exception. My guess is his
code wasn't correct, but one bug (overly-broad try/except) masked
another.

ChrisA
Denis McMahon
2013-09-30 22:09:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mark Lawrence
Post by Grant Edwards
Post by Νίκος
You fail to understand that these code i now use was written with the
help of regulars here and yes its correct.
If you're code is correct, then use it and be happy.
There's no need to bother us if your code is correct.
Could this be an extremely rare case whereby the original code is 100%
correct but the problems have been exacerbated by the many suggested
patches given here being 100% incorrect?
I'm sending you the bill for hospital admission. I laughed so hard I fell
off of my chair and banged my head!
--
Denis McMahon, denismfmcmahon at gmail.com
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